Good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Wherever you are I hope you have blue skies and let’s talk to the newbies today. Welcome to That Other Lifestyle podcast. I am your host Jayson, leave Vanilla behind as we dive into the Lifestyle.
Today we are talking about newbies, new couples and the role of mentors in the Lifestyle And the dreaded newbie hunters. Don’t know what a newbie hunter is? Stay tuned.
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I did a livestream on SDC last week to launch the course. It was really good. People asking questions and get lots of positive feedback. Go over to Thatotherlifestyle on SDC and you can see the unedited raw video. Probably going to post it YouTube in a few weeks. And join my group while you are there.
I am on my quest to hit 20,000 downloads. Getting close. If you like the show, can I trouble you for a review? Anywhere, whatever platform you are currently listening to this show, drop me a review, five stars, a smiley face. Every comment I get help fuels my passion for this show.
Please note this podcast is intended only for adults. Not safe for work. We will talk about adult or sexual topics, and I will use salty language, often. This content is for entertainment purposes only and again only for those over 18 years of age.
I also try to be as inclusive with my language and terms as I can. It can be challenging to formulate and write and say all the inclusive terms in every instance. For simplicity's sake and time management, I may use terms like husband or wife or partner, or spouse for the purpose of the narrative I am sharing. This podcast is for everyone though, no matter your background, gender identity, gender expression, or whatever truth you may be living. Everyone is welcome no matter how you personally experience the lifestyle and ethical non-monogamy.
I started writing this episode and threw away the first draft. My original idea was this epic poetic beautiful story of a couple washing ashore on Lifestyle Island. Disheveled and exhausted, they made the dive off the bow of the last boat to leave Vanilla world. In the inky darkness, judgement slithered and swims. Fear gripped their hearts, fear of being outed, fear of peer pressure, just fear. They fought the waves all night, to wake up naked and afraid on a beach, unsure which way to go and how to get started. Then there was this whole framing device about them traveling this island trying to figure out the Lifestyle. Real allegorical story.
The whole idea became convoluted and I was losing the meaning of what I wanted to say. To summarize it, new couples join the lifestyle. They may encounter mentors who want to help them or be preyed upon by newbie hunters. Guess I need to explain the difference between a mentor and a newbie hunter. So instead of listing all the resources, I want to focus on mentors and newbie hunters specifically.
This episode is going to cause some internally cringing, I am positive. Let me make this distinction between a mentor, a newbie hunter and a kind person wanting to help. The distinction between mentors and newbie hunters is intention. Mentors have the intention to genuinely help, even if they fuck it up, the intention is good. Newbie hunters have the intention of taking advantage of newbies.
If you listen to this episode and suddenly wonder if you are a newbie hunter, what is your intention? Is it to help people or prey upon them? I want to get that concept out the way right now.
This episode idea came about while I was doing the webinar on SDC last week. I showed up to talk about men. Sexy men. Sexy men flirting. That’s not where the conversation went. Watching the chat and comments roll on, it was people asking what I think are basic questions about the lifestyle. Like what about protection and what about making profiles? Stuff that my wife and I went through when we started the Lifestyle.
A facet of this lifestyle that is forgotten way too often is that everyone is new at some point, new people join every day and new people need guidance. Some people take to the LS like fish in water others flop around trying to figure out their way. And the lifestyle can be complicated, the lifestyle can be mystical and daunting and weird.
One of the reasons my show exists is to help newbies navigate through the awkward first year until they get their feet under them. Help newbies with advice. When a couple starts in the LS, they have to get up to speed on a brand-new culture with its own language and rules and etiquette. A culture that exists behind, above, below, separate and in the shadows of the vanilla world.
I often talk about single guys having to shift their entire mindset to function in the lifestyle away from their ideas of how dating works in the vanilla world. A good example is for single guys, they function independently chasing a single woman. In the lifestyle, you got a couple to deal with and connect with. The how of figuring out that dynamic is where good advice comes in. Same thing with couples. They have to shift their outlook on dating and marriage and relationships to a new way of thinking. That shift can be uncomfortable and overwhelming. That’s why all new LS people need advice and help.
Besides all the online articles and podcasts, like mine, listen every week and tell people about it, we need to talk about what a new couple who joins the lifestyle may encounter.
For every couple that walks there is another that stumbles. No fault of their own, this is a lot of learn and figure out. That’s where having a mentor person or couple can be invaluable. But those new couples could also be prey to newbie hunters.
Throwing out definitions here. A mentor couple is a seasoned experienced couple that helps new couples in learning the lifestyle. It is a noble act. Newbie Hunters are couples that prey upon new couples in the lifestyle for their own motivations. Remember what I said about intent? One helps and the other hurts.
Another fundamental difference between the two. You will find mentors. Hunters find you. Mentors help you integrate into the larger LS community; newbie hunters try to separate you from the community.
Why am I talking about mentors and newbie hunters? During the webinar there was a couple, and I have no idea who they were, they began asking questions while I was chatting with the crowd. Very pointed questions. They said they were new to the LS. Then they asked about what to do on a first date.
I told them to do something unusual, go play minigolf or axe throwing, my personal favorite. You don’t have to have dinner and a bar as a first dance. They clarified that the first date would be happening at the other couple’s house. So, I mentioned this other couple, they are probably looking for fuckery and y’all need to be ready for that, talked about setting boundaries and figuring out your rules ahead of time.
Then this mysterious couple dropped, that their date couple did not want to use protection. The other couple wanted to go bareback. Which set off alarm bells in my head and funny enough other people in the webinar started commenting on this as well.
I told the couple that we all need to manage risk mitigation in our own way as safely as possible and as best we can. And then it hit me. They were dealing with newbie hunters. And other people started saying the same thing so it ain’t just Jason being crazy.
Which that got me to thinking about mentors and newbie hunters and what is the difference between the two. The existence of mentors is self-explanatory. The existence of newbie hunters is a secret that needs to be blown wide open. People need to know about this term and concept and what a newbie hunter is. Yeah, it is an unpleasant side of the LS, but we can not get better as a culture unless we address the icky parts of the lifestyle. And newbie hunters are icky, and I will tell you why.
Mentors are great if you find them. They are super wonderful people who help make the lifestyle better in every way. Newbie hunters are bad. Just fucking bad. I don’t see anyone else talking about newbie hunters in the LS thought leader space, so yeah let’s talk about that.
But Jason you think, you always make the lifestyle sound like sunshine and rainbows and yes there are a lot of positives in the LS. But I would be remiss without mentioning the negative aspects especially for new couples.
One of the biggest differences is that you find mentors and newbie hunters find you. You may go to a party and strike up a conversation with an experienced couple. They start teaching you things about the LS. All the nuances and weird quirks that are out there. Might help you get into new social circles. Notice they did not actively hunt you down. They didn’t reach out on a social site and say “Can’t help but notice you are new, we are willing to devote our time and attention to you so you can become successful in the lifestyle.” More organic in the connection.
On the other hand, hunters find you. As soon as you make a new profile, within maybe six to 24 hours your inbox is going to be flooded with people reaching out. I know it happened to us. Those messages might be well intentioned invites to parties, other couples just reaching out to say and welcome you, but I fucking guarantee at least two of them will be from newbie hunters.
They will offer to show you the ropes, or test drive your wife as one couple so eloquently put it to us. Word to the wise, never use that fucking phrase, ever. Newbie hunters are actively on adult social sites, waiting for new members to join. I don’t know how they do this besides obsessively hitting refresh every 20 minutes.
A mentor will be honest with you. They will share the good and the bad sides of the Lifestyle. They will help you figure out delicate situations. A mentor is great. They hopefully will even be brutally honest with you because the world needs more honesty.
A mentor may tell you flat out, you and your spouse should not be in the LS. Mentors are going to be honest with you on whether or not they think the LS is a good fit for you. Granted, you and your spouse are the only ones who can truly determine that but after you have been around a while, you can tell who is a good fit for this lifestyle and who isn’t. And for those that this ain’t a good fit, it might not be a bad thing for someone to come out and state that y’all need to reevaluate your situation. Which sounds really harsh, but people need a slap in the face every now and then.
Why do couples mentor new couples? I know the vanilla thought is, well they just want to have sex with you. Not really. Mentors genuinely want people to enjoy the Lifestyle and enjoy helping people assimilate. Nothing nefarious unlike hunters.
I know for me, it is a lot of fun to talk to new couples. The enthusiasm, the sheer wonder, and the flood of questions. Their joy is beautiful, and it is beautiful to be a part of it. It’s fun to explain all the nuances of the LS to newbies.
The Lifestyle can be desensitizing. It is fun for experienced couples to share stories of their escapades, dust off the adventures and reshare the experiences with others to see the wonder it brings them. A threesome for experienced couples might be just another Tuesday night but for newbies, it blows their minds. Sharing those stories, giving advice, helping people reinvigorates the passion we all have for the LS.
A key difference between mentors and hunters, mentors don’t care if they have sex with you. It might happen, it might not, no big deal either way. Hunters on the other hand, they are looking to get laid in the easiest way possible. Experienced couples require work, new couples not so much.
Mentors have been around this wild world enough to learn the snags and traps. They can share that knowledge with new couples freely and happily. Hunters ain’t going to teach you shit. Nothing. They will only present the LS in a way that benefits them. Mentors will show you the whole spectrum of savoring the LS like explaining full swap or soft swap or different ways to enjoy the company of others. Newbie Hunters are more rigid, they will only present the LS via the lens they enjoy. If the Newbie Hunters are full swap, they will try to convince newbies that full swap is the only proper way to experience the LS because it helps the newbie hunters.
Protection. Using protection. A mentor will tell you to use condoms. Mentors will explain the pros and cons of using different kinds of protection, maybe their own horror stories and then let you make up your own mind.
Hunters, they don’t want to use condoms. Condoms are not necessary in their mind because if you are new to the Lifestyle then you are automatically clean. You are not tainted with the sex juices of others. Hunters assume that if you are new, then you must be free of STI’s which means there is no need for condoms. Which is total bullshit. Use a condom. Hunters don’t want to use condoms as in the story I shared earlier. Maybe they don’t like them, or they don’t think they are necessary.
Hunters think we are STI free, whether they have proof of that or not. Side note hunters tend not to get tested. Always ask for test results. And if they are free of STIs and this new couple is obviously free of STIs because they are new then there is no need for condoms, right?
Here’s a pro tip. If a couple doesn’t want to use condoms with you, then that means they are probably not using condoms with other people. For condoms if there is a couple you trust, there is established history of test results, everyone is open and honest about who else they are fucking, that could be a discussion. Ya’ll are adults so make an adult decision by having an adult conversation.
Newbie hunters, nah. They ain’t going to have that discussion. They are preying on the naivete of new couples to push going bareback because these new couples don’t know any better.
Newbie hunters’ prey on new couples and take advantage of them. I said it. Fight me. New couples who don’t know any better, who think all this behavior is okay because of ignorance.
Why do newbie hunters do it? Well, a couple of reasons. New couples are easy. Experienced couples can use their no, know how to use their no and can be more discerning. Newbie hunters know this. It is easier to get laid with a new couple than an experienced couple.
New couples are easier to influence and unsure of the dynamics of the Lifestyle so if the hunters know this and can manipulate the new couple easier. If all this sounds really scummy and sketchy that is because it is.
There is a segment of people in the LS who enjoy flipping vanilla couples. They get off on converting new couples. I don’t personally like it. My wife and I have a rule, no new couples. We have this rule because I don’t want to be in the room when a man suddenly realizes he has a problem with his wife getting new dick. Or the wife realizing she doesn’t want this. I don’t want to deal with that so we have a no new couples rule. I ain’t the one to do that. I give my advice via a podcast so that’s my contribution.
Yeah, there are couples who actively enjoy converting vanillas. Or maybe they really enjoy being a couple’s first. If that is your kink, I ain’t going to shame you for it. But there are consequences for it. You may be fucking up a really good marriage. That other couple that you decided looked cute at the bar and then somehow seduced, yeah they may not be okay with happened after the fact.
I know people have free will and in this dynamic we are assuming everyone is a consenting adult. But I also know horny brain will override a lot of logical decisions.
Another key difference between a mentor and a hunter is boundaries and respecting boundaries. It can take a while for a couple to decide to go full swap, actually do the penetration. And that’s okay. Everyone can move up and down the spectrum of swapping as they see fit. Some couples never swap, some stay at soft swap forever, some go to full swap, don’t like it and go back to soft swap. All personal preference that is then turned into a boundary for you. You set a limit, this is the line and other people need to respect it. Not push on it hoping you will change your mind.
A mentor will respect your personal boundaries. If y’all have decided to only do soft swap, mentors and most LS couples are fine with that. Hunters will try to push those boundaries. Newbie hunters present this argument as ff you are soft swap then it is only inevitable that you will go full swap, which it isn’t, so might as well be full swap right now with us. That sort of thing. Right the logic makes sense, yeah let’s go ahead and do this even if you are not comfortable with it and your marriage is not ready for it. Who cares what you think, these hunters want to get off.
Which illustrates a complete disregard for you as a person, disregard for your marriage and disrespect. Hunters treat other people like sex objects. You are nothing more than an animated Fleshlight to these couples.
Hunters are going to attention bomb. I would say love bomb but that doesn’t sound right in the lifestyle context so let’s say attention bomb. As in they want to hang out every weekend, text every day. Which is fine with couples that you share a connection and friendship, fuck hang out all the time if you want. There are people I enjoy spending time with, but we grew into that sort of relationship not right off the bat.
Hunters want you all to themselves. They are possessive. They don’t want you hanging out and definitely not having sex with other couples. Because if you have sex with other couples then you are no longer their clean special snowflakes. Hunters will be jealous if you engage with other couples be it just dates or sex.
But the same standard does not apply to the hunters. Hunters see themselves as free to do as they please with whoever they please but not the new couple. This is straight up control. This is wrong. This is where the nefarious aspects come in. Hunters want to control new couples and how they experience the lifestyle.
Another big difference between a mentor and a newbie hunter. Something you can take away to check what you are dealing with. Mentors will want to and actually introduce you to the larger LS community. Be it local chat groups or meet ups or friendships, mentors will do their best to help integrate new couples into the wider LS world.
Hunters on the other hand. No. They will not help new couples integrate into the wider community because then there is a danger the new couple will make new friends and it will be harder for the hunters to control them. Mentors open doors for you while hunters will close those doors and keep them shut.
The progression of a relationship comparing mentors to hunters is also important. For mentors I guess the ultimate goal is you no longer need them. They may stay friends and be a part of your LS tribe but there is only so much mentoring they can offer. After a new couple gains experience, there is no more need for a mentor. They can stand on their own two feet, or four feet and go on to experience the LS however they choose.
Newbie hunters. No fuck that. You don’t outgrow them. They drop you. Whether dramatically or simply, hunters move on. Once they have exhausted their target they move on. In the hunter’s mind, you are only wanted and worthy if you are new. If you are no longer new, as determined by their own fucked criteria, they drop you.
That criteria could be time or if the new couple meets another couple and has sex with them or whatever. Newbie hunters will move on to new prey. That’s a fundamental sign of what we are dealing with. The new couple as they gain experience, i.e. has sex with other couples, that taints the view of the newbie hunters towards their prey. So no longer clean and shiny, out the door.
A mentor will want you to grow in the Lifestyle. You might make mistakes, but they will be there to support you as you make those mistakes. Newbie hunters are the mistake you can make.
If I can offer advice to new couples, and however you determine that you are personally new to the LS. Some people measure their new-ness based off the number of couples, which I ain’t a fan of others use time which I think is a much better metric. Time brings experience. You learn what you like and don’t like. Your personal rules will evolve based on what you have to deal with. And I like that. I encourage all couples to keep evolving in this the LS as new challenges or successes come up.
My advice to new couples is to be wary of newbie hunters. Be on the lookout. Quantifiable signs you dealing with a newbie hunter. Not all couples that reach out to you on a social site are newbie hunters, even the ones that say really dumb or crass or sexist remarks because they might just be bad at flirting.
The more concrete signs to look out for, controlling is one. Is this other couple trying to become your sole interaction with the lifestyle as in they insist and want you to hang out with them exclusively? We are adults and can associate with whoever we want.
In general, the LS has a don’t ask, don’t tell policy. If one of our friends goes out on a date with someone else, I am not going to ask for details. And I ain’t going to share details of our adventures with others. As long as everyone had fun and if y’all did fuck, it was done safely, that’s the limit of my give a shit meter.
Newbie hunters will want to control you. They will want to isolate you from the larger community, which could take the form of them not wanting you to go to a party or a club. Remember, they lose control if you meet new people. They lose their exclusivity with you. If you are the only couple they associate with, then they don’t have to worry about competition.
Sliding right next to that, being overly interested in what you do without them. As I said, generally there is a don’t ask, don’t tell policy. But if another couple starts prying into who else you are seeing, what are you doing with them, did you have sex with them? Did you use protection? Who are they? Like really prying for fucking details here, not cool. It ain’t no one else’s business who you are fucking. Period.
I will throw this last tidbit here. Newbie hunters tend not to be connected or plugged in very well with the local LS community. It makes sense. If the local LS community is made up of experienced couples and newbie hunters only want inexperienced couples, there is nothing for newbie hunters in this community. Now newbie hunters may claim they can introduce newbies to all these new friends and communities but that rarely happens because well see my previous point about control and isolation.
Plus, once a couple has a reputation as a newbie hunter, most experienced couples don’t want to deal with them. The act of bringing in newbies into the lifestyle is not a glorious, glamorous, noble thing. You don’t get a fucking trophy. It is not a point of pride in the LS community of how many new couples you could mentor or have sex with.
We get asked by vanilla people about new couples. People in the vanilla world look at newbies the same way as newbie hunters so there must be a parallel there. They think newbies as fresh meat ready to be fucked and enjoyed and that’s wrong on so many levels. Maybe newbie hunters are really vanilla people dressed up as LS.
I think this is a vanilla construct that seeps into the LS world. In the vanilla world, shitty people consider taking someone’s virginity as an accomplishment. It’s not. It’s not a notch on the belt nor should it be considered the mark of manhood, but it is.
There is an analogous thought here that vanilla people find the idea of being a couple’s first LS experience as an accomplishment worthy of renown. The vanilla world thinks that is a thing. In the LS world, it is not. I have never heard anyone brag about being another couple’s first experience. Never heard it.
With new couples, they have no fucking clue what they are doing. The sex will be awkward. The interactions will be awkward, they have no idea how to pace and balance the experience. Which no fault to new couples, Ya’ll just don’t know. And that’s okay. You learn from it. All those bad encounters teach you how to have good encounters. I am not encouraging people to mentor or not mentor new couples. You do you. I encourage new couples to find mentors if you can. Mentors can save you so much frustration and headaches in all this
Mentors will mentor other couples because it is a noble and good thing too. Mentors are people who naturally fall into that role and enjoy it. That entails teaching and helping, not fucking.
If a couple has sex with a new couple, okay yah congratulations, I guess. You had awkward sex with another couple who may or may not be 100% on board with it. Did you make their LS experience better? Did you teach them how to be in the LS? Did you show them proper etiquette and actions? That’s the bigger question. Did you leave that new couple in a better state than when they joined?
Again, bringing in a new couple, fucking a new couple, is not an accomplishment. You don’t win a prize. There is no grand ceremony. There is no pineapple badge given out. No one is going to throw you a parade for fucking newbies. And the newbies won’t get a trophy.
If you want to be a mentor, then please help couples to be better than when you met them. That is the criteria for a good LS mentor. Teach them. Show them the way. Help them get through the awkward and weird bits. Teach new couples about the LS until they no longer need you.
I know there are people out there listening who may be bothered by me sharing what I have about newbie hunters. It is a touchy subject. If you are now having a little freakout that you are a newbie hunter, you are not. Because you are freaking out and reevaluating how you operate. The real newbie hunters who are listening to this, in their minds they are guilty of none of this.
That was a heavy episode. Let’s talk about happy stuff. Risqué Lifestyle Parties is throwing their Halloween party on October 25th and October 26th. My wife and I will be there looking fantastic. My wife handmade my costume. Sewed it by hand. I am so excited.
I won’t spoil it now, but we will have pictures up on SDC after the party. If you can, I encourage everyone to check out the Risqué parties. Their website is risquelifestyleparties.com.
I always appreciate hearing your feedback and comments on episodes or suggestions for topics, so feel free to reach out to me. Men’s Guide to Flirting in the Lifestyle course is coming next week. Go to Thatotherlifestyle.com next week to get the course.
My personal disclaimer, I am not a medical professional nor a trained and certified educator of any kind in any way. I am a guy with a microphone, sharing my personal experiences with you. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only and please join us for the next episode.
Whatever you may do today, I hope it is a fantastic time doing it. Know that you are appreciated and loved. Have a great day.
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