Episode 76 – Bad Dates

Good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Wherever you are I hope you have blue skies. Welcome to That Other Lifestyle podcast. I am your host Jayson, leave Vanilla behind as we reminisce on bad dates.

This podcast is for adults only. We’ll be diving into adult and sexual topics with plenty of colorful language, so it’s not safe for work. If you’re under 18, this isn’t the place for you. This show is all about exploring the lifestyle and ethical non-monogamy, and it’s open to everyone no matter your background, gender identity, expression, or personal truth. While I do my best to use inclusive language, you might hear terms like husband, wife, or partner for simplicity’s sake. This show is for everyone, lifestyle, vanilla, or the curious.

Want to connect? Send me an email to host@thatotherlifestyle.com, visit my website at thatotherlifestyle.com. Everyone is welcome here because the lifestyle is about so much more than you think.

I cannot listen to Linkin Park. That band that made that song from the first Transformers movie. They are still around, making music for robot movies. But I can’t listen to them. Any time they come on the radio, big nope from me. I have to turn the channel. What could have happened that would completely turn me off to a band?

No offense to any fans of the band. The reason is a bad date. Sitting across from a man that was the embodiment of living mayonnaise, pale, bland, spreadable, watching him desperately throw anything and everything at my wife to illicit some interest while his wife emasculates him, this gentleman turned to me and asked me if I liked Linken Park.

I told him I have no strong opinion on the band either way. Not on my gym workout playlist so I am neutral. I prefer harder, heavier music. Long live rock and roll. He said that love of Linken Park was a deal breaker for any further friendship. I know he was kidding. Laughed it off. Then his wife chimed in that he only listens to dad rock and no one else likes his taste in music. The man, already slight of frame and bashful folded himself further into his own body like a chastised turtle.

My wife gave me a look. That look of what the fuck did you do Jayson and why are we still here. I looked back at her and smiled. I wanted to ride this train wreck. We were sitting on the patio of a restaurant in hard metal chairs that made my ass hurt.

My wife and I made dinner plans with this couple. Local thing. No pressure, right? We had been texting for a few weeks. No red flags I can remember. Actually, there was a red flag now that I write this out. We never saw pictures of them. They didn’t share any pictures. To new to know what that meant. I know what it means now.

We arrive at the restaurant and get a table. We always show up a few minutes early, just in case. Power play maybe. That way you can be the one that they approach. I don’t know if that is a thing or not. Usually, I am so prompt with everything I end up arriving everywhere early then wonder where everyone is because I have been waiting ten minutes.

The couple walked in. She was dressed as a school girl while he was wearing a silk shirt, mostly unbuttoned exposing his hairless white chest. I could hear my wife’s vagina dry out. Like a reverse sponge. She looked at me and said what the fuck did you do? Me? I responded. You are on this train with me.

We were new to all this. Didn’t know what we know now. Tolerated a lot more. I didn’t know the red flags. Dinner went well, though I did sneak off to the bathroom to double check their profiles. And that is when I learned on some of the sites you can see when the pictures were uploaded. Their pictures were seven years old. Seven. Years. Old.

The conversation was stilted. My wife had zero interest in this man. I could see it. Pursed lips, distant look. She kept running her fingers over the edge of her empty glass. No second round here. Just ready to be done. And we couldn’t leave.

The wife was bubbly. That kind of bubbly that is only exasperated by alcohol. The kind of bubbly that lets you know in no uncertain terms, this woman is interested. She caressed my knee. She leaned forward to press her words into my body. All I could wonder is where the fuck did, she get a school girl outfit this time of year. She already owned that. She chose to wear that. I would say the outfit left details to the imagination, but I really didn’t want to imagine any of that.

You know how you want to wait for a natural stopping point to end a conversation. Never really got to that point because this man was throwing everything at my wife to impress her. He asked my wife about her job, her super boring corporate job. Nope that was a dead end. An immediate turnoff is to ask my wife about her job. She doesn’t enjoy it so why talk about it?

This dude mentioned that he played in a band, 15 years ago. So that didn’t work. He mentioned the Linken Park as I said. He asked my wife if she liked sports cars. This perked up her ears until he clarified that he used to own a sports car and they traded it in for a minivan. To which his wife cackled and mentioned how much stuff they could fit in the van and how sad this man was when he had to trade in his sports car.

After dinner we migrated to the patio to free up a table. As we transitioned, my wife is sending me the death eyes. You know those eyes. Eyes full of venom and blame. I whispered at least we will have a good story. She made it clear we are not doing this again and I smiled. I know.

Finally, I had to call it. In the middle of his sentence, I don’t remember what he was saying, I did the welp time to go thing. They were sad. In consolation he offered for my wife, and I guess me, to come over to their pool sometimes. Oh, you have a pool I asked. He said, well technically it is for the apartment complex, but we were welcome to come over, of course I had to be mindful of my wife’s bikini choices.

I’m skipping over so many details and twists and turns in the interest of time and my word count. So yeah, that was one of our worst dates. Had another couple get into a fight at dinner. Like hushed arguing. Had another couple, apparently his wife had coached him on answers to questions, and he kept fucking up. Innocent shit like their age.

Bad dates. We have all have had bad dates. Apologies, you have not had a bad date? Just wait. Bad dates are both subjective and require experience to truly appreciate. Two couples can go out on a date, and you leave the encounter wondering who the fuck these people are and how are they allowed in public. A friend can go out with the same couple and enjoy them. All subjective to the viewer, kind of like art. Some people see a scribble; others see a life changing abstract painting.

Granted there are couples out there that are just bad fucking dates. Unsettled, jealous, boring, drunk, lots of options on the bad date bingo card. Maybe today I can share stories from my own collection, give out warnings and hopefully help you become a better date.

When you are new, every date is fun. When we started, we dated a lot more. Excited to meet new couples, yeah sure let’s go to dinner. And in hindsight, some of those dates were really fucking bad. We didn’t have perspective on what makes a good date so we couldn’t say what was bad about a date, general sense of unease. The ick. The “don’t stick you dick in crazy” kind of moment.

We went on a date once where the activity was go-kart racing. Not exactly my jam. I mean… I own a driver’s license and a full-sized adult car, but sure—let’s go play Mario Kart: Midlife Crisis Edition.

This guy? He smoked me. Beat me by seconds, minutes, hell, maybe even a whole lap. Whatever. Didn’t bother me. My self-worth isn’t measured by how well I can Tokyo Drift in a lawnmower with a seatbelt.

See, my pride is tied to more important things. Like the fact that my dick works. His? Not so much. And honestly, in my experience, the more arrogant the guy, the more likely his penis won’t be up for the party.

We have all been there. For the newbies who may tune in, let’s talk about what makes a bad date so we have a good place to start. And I can share so many stories about the bad dates we have been on.

Got to reenforce this, you may have a bad date with a couple, and your friends go out with them and have a fantastic time. All subjective to the encounter, the situation, the location and the conversation. There are generally a couple of notes that I think we can all agree on.

Here is a huge turn off. One sided conversation. We went on a date one time with a couple years ago. This man talked for two hours solid. I am not exaggerating. My wife and I barely got a word in. He talked about his life history, his family, his job, his shoes. Bless his little heart. He did not want single second of silence. The only time his wife talked to us is when he went to the bathroom. I have to give people grace on this and other situations because doing a date can be anxiety inducing. If you are new or don’t date much or maybe the date is with an intimidating couple, yeah, I get it.

Going back to dating in the Lifestyle, it’s a new animal. Especially if you have not been on a date in twenty years. And don’t take all this to mean we are perfect at dates either. We are not. Positive someone out there is sharing a story about us at parties and how much we suck on a particular occasion. Positive at some point in our LS journey, another couple have faked their kid being sick to bail on us. Positive at some point in our LS journey, two couples have ditched us to go have their own fun. That one hurt and it sucks. I am not coming from a place of expert, this is the voice of experience.

Back to it. Conversations should flow. Conversations are a four way dynamic just like sex. Here is a tip if a person is bad at conversation; they will probably be bad at sex. If the dude or the woman for that matter only wants to talk about themselves and nerves are not the reason, some people just fucking want to dominant the conversation, yeah, I can almost guarantee, bad sex.

Or the stone silent couple. Like they are waiting at a doctor’s office and don’t want to speak to you. To avoid this, we have topics to talk about. Do this. Talk to your spouse and come up with a list of things you are interested in or passionate about that are not your children, job or medical history. I have a conversation guide available on my website, thatotherlifestyle.com, which can help. Sign up with an email and get a free copy. Don’t worry, I don’t send out emails.

The bragger couples. They brag about how much money they have, how popular they are and by extension how they can make you more popular by hanging out with them. They like to flex their wealth like it makes them more attractive. It does not. And from personal experience, I can tell you that couple that wants to help make you more popular, introduce you to more people, they won’t. They are bragging to get into your pants.

Tell you another story. We met a couple, and they constantly bragged about being close to another couple and how popular they were and having an in to an exclusive hotel takeover. They ghosted us. We ended up going to the exclusive hotel takeover event a year later and no one knew who the hell they were.

I have said it before that you can tell a lot about whether these people are worth your time based on how they treat each other. Going back to my date story at the start. At one point during dinner, the other husband asked my wife if she liked motorcycles. My wife responded that she was neutral. Noticing a pattern here. Poor bastard couldn’t make a connection. Well, he shared that he wanted to get a motorcycle. And his wife chimed in that he could not. She would not allow it, and she would not pay the insurance for it there by emasculating this poor bastard in front of us. That was awkward. Which I love awkward, so I am here for it.

Here is another one. The heavy drinker. I get it a first date can be intense, especially for newbies but come on. Don’t drink too much. Keep it under control. If you need a couple shots of whiskey in order to function or some sort of gummy for your social anxiety, hey might be time to calm the fuck down. I have seen a man finish an entire bottle of wine at dinner, then ask for a margarita. Dinner is maybe an hour, maybe two if you talk after. Whole bottle and then some. I sat in disbelief. I am not a heavy drinker, so this was impressive to me.

Ever gone on a date with people that were not swingers? We have. A guy messaged me through a dating site and wanted to go out one night. They were honest, said they were interested in the lifestyle so we figured, sure this could be an opportunity to mentor and introduce them to the lifestyle. Which was a wonderful thought we had till we showed up and it turns out the husband did not tell the wife what was going on. The husband sprung this on her.

They got home from work, he told her to get dressed up and didn’t share all the details of the date. Husband and wife show up. Husband has the biggest smile on his face, and his wife looks confused. They sit down and he declares that we are swingers. The wife turns ghost white. He didn’t tell her they were having dinner with heathens.

My wife, the wonderful angel that she is, caught this. She turned to the wife and in the most reassuring voice, told the wife that nothing is happening. This is just dinner. I could tell the other wife was having a silent freakout that her husband dragged her to this dinner to fulfill a fantasy that she was not ready for.

The husband starts playing ask a swinger. Ever happen to you. It happens to me all the time since we are very open about this. Someone finds out what we do for fun then questions start. He did have some knowledge about all this. This is where I got one of my favorite sayings.

This dude asked about getting his wife an anklet or a black ring. Which keeps in mind at this point, he was running with this idea. They had discussed having a threesome or adding in a new dick a few times and he got excited. So excited he made a profile without her knowing, set up a date and now this poor woman is trying to process all this.

Anyway, he asked about jewelry. My wife will wear a very small demure pineapple she will wear sometimes but nothing that screams Hey we are swingers and looking for fun. I asked him, if he saw a woman wearing an anklet on the other side of the bar, would he approach her? Did he think that a piece of jewelry was enough? For clarification, I know people who wear anklets and black rings. And I never fucking notice them. I couldn’t tell you if I have ever seen one in a public space because I don’t look for them. We are not out on a Friday at a random bar looking for connections.

I told him, “No piece of jewelry will give you any actional intelligence about anyone’s sex life”. I love that phrase and I use it often. He kept asking questions. He asked about how often we fucked around with other people, and I told him that could be considered a faux pas to ask. At that point in time, my wife and I had a special lady friend. Her husband was traveling a lot so she would hang out with us. And he asked if our relationship was transactional. As in we are keeping track of how often we hang out with our special lady friend so her husband, when he gets home, will be entitled to have sex with my wife an equal number of times. Like fuck no dude. It was awkward. Not sure what happened to them. Afterward he sent me a few spicy pics of his wife, and I had to ask, does she know you are sharing this and is she cool with it? He stopped texting after that.

Finally, you need to ask yourself can these motherfuckers behave themselves in public. I don’t know why, a contingent of lifestyle people out there, can’t fucking behave in public. They think they are going on a swinger date, and they now have permission to act as wild as possible. No one at the restaurant wants to see us play grab a dick under the table. It is a serious concern you should have if you want to fly under the radar. Are these crazy motherfuckers about to show off tonight? Can we contain this energy? Should we run with this energy?

No discussion of bad dates is complete with adding in red flags for you to watch out for. Leading up to the date itself, what are red flags this will suck? These flags may be red, maybe not. Subjective. Let’s go with a list of stuff because those are easiest to write. I preface all this to say life happens.

Kids get sick, babysitters fall through, cars break down. Shit happens. But what matters is how the other couple, the ones in the shit storm, handle it. Do they cancel the date at the last minute? Which is fucking rude, and it happens. Had it happen to us, don’t take it personally. What happens after matters more. Do they reschedule? Do they apologize?

Rescheduling goes a long way to allaying any concerns about whether or not this couple is worth the time. Flaky couples though, ones who don’t want to commit to a date, yeah that’s a problem.

Here is a hard fact about the lifestyle. Hard truth and I will fight anyone who wants to argue. Some people, not all people, won’t commit to a date until they know all their options. You may ask to hang out on a Monday, and they won’t give you a straight answer until Saturday afternoon. Now they could be looking at schedules and trying to make it work, yeah that happens. Or they could be right shit heads, and they are weighing their options. Waiting to see if something better comes along. People may gather all their weekend invites into a fishbowl and pull one out at random or do a deep forensic analysis into which opportunity has the greatest potential for fuckery. Why go on a date when there is a party they could go to instead?

I have heard horror stories of people ghosting dates. You set up a time and a place and poof them son of bitches don’t show up. Stop communicating. Maybe they got cold feet. Maybe something happened on the car ride over and they decided to quit the lifestyle. I would personally love to be in the car on the ride to the restaurant when a couple decides to quit the Lifestyle. I love awkward.

What’s funny, talking about flaking and ghosting. I see it on profiles. This assertive statement that gets copied and pasted around. The couple will express how they never flake or ghost and expect the same from others. That they go through all the trouble and expense of securing childcare and time, and they demand that couples show up for dates. Yeah, you tell them. You tell all those people looking at ass and titties on this stie your commitment to showing up. Does this help? I haven’t a fucking clue. You can demand respect all you want on a dating profile; doesn’t mean you will get it.

A few more red flags. Arrogance. I need to add this one since we recently encountered it and it is a huge fucking turn off. We asked a couple to meet for drinks via texting and the gentleman responded with ready for this, get in line. That’s it. Told us to get in line.  I could hear his asshole pucker up after he sent the text through the ether of the universe. His wife jumped in to smooth it out and say they have a lot of other commitments, and he didn’t mean it that way. Okay dude. You said it. Live with it. We are moving on.

If a couple acts like they are doing you a favor in going on a date, walk the fuck away. I promise that will be a miserable time and you are saving yourself the price of dinner by not fucking around with them.

Another red flag. The overly pushy couple. It’s one thing if the sexy talk is amicable between everyone and there is a clear expectation leading into a date. But it’s another thing when the other party really wants to fuck around and you are still in the figuring them out stage. Pro tip. If a couple asks to go to second location, they want to fuck you. If they ask about testing or your play style, they want to fuck you. Speaking of testing, go to STDHero.com for all your STI testing needs. Use promo code TOL15 for 15% off your order.

Now whether or not you want to fuck them, that’s what you have to find out by having the date. And we have had a sexy offer sprung on us at dinner. Talking to a couple, had dinner and at the end of it, they said they had a hotel for the night, and we were welcome to come join them. I love this. There was no pressure. They even got up and excused themselves so my wife and I could talk it out. That is stellar. That is so kind. We then had to stop by a store to get condoms because this was way before we started carrying a hoe bag. This encounter is the reason we started carrying a hoe bag all the time. It’s never a guarantee anything will happen, but I want to be ready damn it.

Here is a weird one. The couple that is not dressed for the occasion. By that I mean either they put zero effort in their appearance, baggy t-shirt and looking like they rolled out of bed at 6pm on Friday night or the couple that is dressed in club outfits. Like neon green fishnet stockings and her butt checks hanging out. Yes, the sexy outfits are amazing but not at a Buffalo Wild Wings.

Now dear listener, what happens if you find yourself on a bad date? When the bombs are dropping, racist, sexist, misogynistic, mean, or boring bombs? First dates, please always go to a public space. I know that couple made their house sound really cool. They have a foosball table and a sex room but come on be smart here.

After our series of bad dates, my wife and I learned to use code phrases. Innocent things we can drop into a conversation to communicate what we are thinking without anyone the wiser. This is a way better method than your wife frantically tapping then slapping your leg under the table and you are not sure what the fuck she is trying to tell you via morse code.

For couples who had kids, that is always the perfect out. Fake a text message and oh no the kid is sick, and we need to go. I know people do this. I have heard of people doing this. Kids get sick a lot.

Always bring cash. In case the date goes really sideways, and you can’t wait for the check, throw cash on the table to cover the meal and walk out. You have full power to walk away from a date. You don’t owe anyone an explanation or reason. They start talking politics and ranting about conspiracy theories, time to go. Fuck being graceful and polite. Just go.

We talked about what makes a bad date, red flags to look out for, that this will be a wild shit show. Here is a question to ponder. If you go on a date with a couple and it is a wild shit show, they are guilty of multiple infractions I have discussed today, do you say anything?

I don’t know the answer. I don’t know the right answer. Here is another hard truth. Those shit show couples tend to wash out of the Lifestyle after a few months. Word gets around that they are walking red flags and people don’t want to associate with them. Will they ever know that their behavior is a problem? I don’t know.

To address the behavior that would require confrontation. Are people in the lifestyle confrontational? No more so than the rest of the population. I have found people who will speak up right quick and others who don’t say a word. Having a difficult conversation about the actions of others, that’s a hard one with no firm etiquette. I can tell you how to do an orgy, can’t tell you how to confront someone.

We have had our fair share of bad dates and bad other encounters. Have I addressed? Not many times. The rub is if a couple is so bad you never want to interact with them again, why bother engaging again?

And I know there is a population of people out there who want to help and mentor and foster newbies in the Lifestyle. I get that. People who want to naturally help others. Help them get better at the lifestyle. This is noble and good.

This conversation could be very good for couples who habitually do bad dates, or it could go very sour. Could come across as being an asshole because no one wants to have their behavior corrected. No adult wants that. Everyone believes themselves to be perfect in their own minds.

I can’t tell you if it is worth it. Can’t tell you if you should do it. If you do decide to say something, do it with grace and courtesy. Assume positive intent. I feel grace is a big factor in the subjective nature of bad dates. Like I said earlier, two couples could go on dates with a bad date couple and have wildly different experiences.

I see a correlation between horniness and acceptance of bad behavior. I said it. It’s out there. The hornier you are for a couple, feeling the sexual connection, the more likely you are to let otherwise rough antics slide. Horniness is a powerful motivator. Thinking with your pecker can get you in trouble or have a lot of fun depending on how you look at it.

How to avoid bad dates? Really, can you? That’s what’s wild when I think about it. You don’t know till you roll the dice on this. Yeah, the couple can say all the right stuff during a chat conversation but until you are in the game, you don’t know. Look bad dates happen. People won’t connect. People may be weird and not in a good way. A woman may slam saki and then decide she needs to pop out a party nipple. I say bad dates should not be avoided.

Bad dates. Sure, they suck in the moment, but they also give you fucking legendary stories to tell later. They’re basically the campfire tales of the Lifestyle. Nothing bonds people faster than trading horror stories like baseball cards, oh, you had the couple that fought in the bathroom for an hour? Good times. And if you ever accidentally become the star of someone else’s horror story, don’t sweat it. Happens to all of us. Somewhere out there, you’re the punchline of a drunken story session, and that’s just part of the game. And you will never know. My buddy has the philosophy that he will never know how many stories he is the main character in. I like that.

For the newbies panicking right now about their date skills: relax. Nobody’s expecting you to be super smooth. Just be yourself, use your words, and most importantly… don’t be a dick. Seriously. That’s the lifestyle’s golden rule. If you can manage that, you’re already ahead of half the competition.

I always appreciate hearing your feedback and comments on episodes or suggestions for topics, so feel free to reach out to me at host@thatotherlifestyle.com. My website is thatotherlifestyle.com.

My personal disclaimer, I am not a medical professional nor a trained and certified educator of any kind in any way. I am a guy with a microphone, sharing my personal experiences with you. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only and please join us for the next episode. Testingr STI testing is important and takes a community to make a difference.  Go to STDHero.com and use my promo code TOL15 for 15% your order.

Whatever you may do today, I hope you have a fantastic time doing it. Know that you are appreciated and loved. Have a great day.